The One Guy
Rust Maid
Posts: 1,148
Pronouns: he/him/his
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Post by The One Guy on Sept 12, 2016 17:22:08 GMT
Dialouge is supposed to be a natural interaction between two Nonsense. No-one wants to read realistic dialogue because it is awkward and stilted and not clever at all. People want to be entertained not reminded of overhearing their two co-workers going on and on about irrelevant stuff. Certainly dialouge shouldn't be completely realistic (and I touched on that a bit in what I said next), but it is supposed to at least seem natural such that it doesn't break one's suspension of disbelief and acurately portrays the characters' voices. |
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inspiredsimji
Gritty Midget
Posts: 263
Pronouns: they/them/theirs
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Post by inspiredsimji on Sept 12, 2016 18:00:05 GMT
Nonsense. No-one wants to read realistic dialogue because it is awkward and stilted and not clever at all. People want to be entertained not reminded of overhearing their two co-workers going on and on about irrelevant stuff. Certainly dialouge shouldn't be completely realistic (and I touched on that a bit in what I said next), but it is supposed to at least seem natural such that it doesn't break one's suspension of disbelief and acurately portrays the characters' voices. Agreed- if I wanted a random series of jokes and memes I wouldn't be reading a story. |
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loading
Raise of the Conductor's Baton
Posts: 435
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Post by loading on Sept 12, 2016 18:38:59 GMT
Speaking of dialogue, how has it been in ThreadStuck, a story told ENTIRELY through dialogue (and ok, I guess account names too)? I feel like it's declined a little bit between stories 2 and 3 but let's be fair here: NOTHING can possibly top the masterpiece that was ThreadStuck Story 2 (and the board-wide aftermath). How have I done with both characterizing templates and templatizing characters?
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tronn
Rungjumpin' Ragamuffin
Posts: 287
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Post by tronn on Sept 12, 2016 19:03:21 GMT
Certainly dialouge shouldn't be completely realistic (and I touched on that a bit in what I said next), but it is supposed to at least seem natural such that it doesn't break one's suspension of disbelief and acurately portrays the characters' voices. See when you're saying 'realistic' you're actually thinking of 'well written'. Consider your favorite TV drama or sitcom. Does the dialogue flow well? Most likely yes. Is it in any way realistic? Most likely not. When you write dialogue for a character don't think of 'what this person would say in real life', think of 'what would be the most fitting thing for this character to say in this situation'instead. Remember that these are characters not real people you're writing, so let them act like characters - they are here to play a role, like an actor going through their lines. What advances the story is what sounds natural for them. Agreed- if I wanted a random series of jokes and memes I wouldn't be reading a story. Literally no-one has suggested that dialogue should be like that. |
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Post by Arashi500 on Sept 12, 2016 21:54:28 GMT
I for one think dialogue dumps are fine as long you use them fairly sparingly. It doesn't become a problem (for me anyway) until huge text boxes that you end up totally losing the image in are done in quick sequence. A nice bit of extended exposition here and there should prolly be fine as long as you don't bury the reader under it.
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Post by continuityofficer on Sept 13, 2016 1:53:59 GMT
I think the way you make diolouge realistic AND interesting, is just kind of assume the people had infinate time to make the responce.
They have time to think of the coolest quips and most interesting observations, but it still flows as a conversation
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Post by Piono on Sept 13, 2016 1:57:45 GMT
Yeah, which also tends to be easier.
Trying to simulate them not having enough time not only worsens the dialogue also makes things a lot harder, because usually YOU have more time to think up things as you want.
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Post by tentacleTherapist on Sept 13, 2016 3:14:25 GMT
Yeah, which also tends to be easier. Trying to simulate them not having enough time not only worsens the dialogue also makes things a lot harder, because usually YOU have more time to think up things as you want. Homestuck unintentionally lampshades this in Act 1: This is apparently a 10 second conversation between Rose and John: "TT: I'm back. EB: hurry up and open my door!!!!!! EB: not that it even matters, i think i'm probably dead no matter what!!!!!! TT: Patience. You still haven't used the new totem. EB:  TT: I believe it will create the item on the punch card. EB: so what is it, like an apple or something? EB: what good will that even do? TT: We'll see. TT: I've found no evidence that anyone has successfully created the item. TT: And the content of the card appears to be variable from session to session. TT: In one instance it was described as an "eggy loking thign" [sic]. EB: do we have enough of those building jewels to make it? TT: According to the Atheneum, it is a free item. TT: This speaks to its importance, in my view. TT: Now off you go." As well as this message occurring in, at the very maximum and alongside various other shenanigans, in 3 minutes: (Even reading it takes a minute and a half)" -- turntechGodhead [TG] began pestering ectoBiologist [EB] at 16:13 -- TG: hey so what sort of insane loot did you rake in today EB: i got a little monsters poster, it's so awesome. i'm going to watch it again today, the applejuice scene was so funny. TG: oh hell that is such a coincidence i just found an unopened container of apple juice in my closet it is like fucking christmas up in here EB: ok thats fine, but i just have one question and then a word of caution. have you ever seen a movie called little monsters starring howie mandel and fred savage? TG: but TG: the seal on the bottle is unbroken TG: are you suggesting someone put piss in my apple juice at the factory EB: all im saying is don't you think monster howie mandel has the power to do something as simple as reseal a bottle? EB: try using your brain numbnuts. TG: why did the fat kid or whoever drank it know what piss tasted like TG: i mean his reaction was nigh instantaneous EB: it was the 15th day in a row howie mandel peed in his juice. TG: ok i can accept that TG: monster B-list celebrity douchebags are cunning and persistent pranksters TG: also fred savage has a really punchable face TG: but who cares about this lets stop talking about it TG: did you get the beta yet EB: no. EB: did you? TG: man i got two copies already TG: but i dont care im not going to play it or anything the game sounds boring TG: did you see how it got slammed in game bro? EB: game bro is a joke and we both know it. TG: yeah TG: why dont you go check your mail maybe its there now EB: alright." |
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tronn
Rungjumpin' Ragamuffin
Posts: 287
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Post by tronn on Sept 13, 2016 8:50:58 GMT
I think the way you make diolouge realistic AND interesting, is just kind of assume the people had infinate time to make the responce. They have time to think of the coolest quips and most interesting observations, but it still flows as a conversation Exactly! We're entertainers not documentarists. Natural sounding dialogue has nothing to do with realism. If you write dialogue that is cool and funny it seems natural to the reader because it flows well. If you try to write what people would say in real life it will sound forced and awkward instead, because it just won't be as polished, processed, and edited. It will lack the snappiness that makes the dialogue seem like it comes naturally to the characters! |
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Post by continuityofficer on Sept 13, 2016 13:05:04 GMT
I think the bigger problem is when people get too distracted by defined personality.
I hold by what i said at the end of last page in that it needs to be a voice, and if your making a character that is made of rules it wont work.
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The One Guy
Rust Maid
Posts: 1,148
Pronouns: he/him/his
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Post by The One Guy on Sept 13, 2016 17:05:01 GMT
Certainly dialouge shouldn't be completely realistic (and I touched on that a bit in what I said next), but it is supposed to at least seem natural such that it doesn't break one's suspension of disbelief and acurately portrays the characters' voices. See when you're saying 'realistic' you're actually thinking of 'well written'. No I'm not? I specifically said "Certainly dialouge shouldn't be completely realistic;" if I meant well written, why would I say dialouge shouldn't be completely well written? I fully understand what you're saying, I'm just just pointing out that dialog should not be so unrealistic as to come off as robotic or as forced exposition. In particular what I worry about when writing dialouge is sounding too much like either me talking to myself or a caricature talking to a caricature. |
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Post by Piono on Sept 13, 2016 17:12:15 GMT
Well, that's not "well written" then, is it?
Robotic or caricatured are both rather jarring and pull you out of the story.
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The One Guy
Rust Maid
Posts: 1,148
Pronouns: he/him/his
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Post by The One Guy on Sept 13, 2016 17:20:44 GMT
Well, that's not "well written" then, is it? Robotic or caricatured are both rather jarring and pull you out of the story. Exactly. Its a case of not being well written due to not being realistic. |
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loading
Raise of the Conductor's Baton
Posts: 435
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Post by loading on Sept 13, 2016 17:23:14 GMT
See when you're saying 'realistic' you're actually thinking of 'well written'. No I'm not? I specifically said "Certainly dialouge shouldn't be completely realistic;" if I meant well written, why would I say dialouge shouldn't be completely well written? I fully understand what you're saying, I'm just just pointing out that dialog should not be so unrealistic as to come off as robotic or as forced exposition. In particular what I worry about when writing dialouge is sounding too much like either me talking to myself or a caricature talking to a caricature. Well, a story comprised of you talking to yourself actually has a lot of potential. Proof: ThreadStuck. |
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Post by Blizzriel on Sept 16, 2016 21:25:30 GMT
The last time I worked on my fanadventure was when I was complaining about trees. I can never focus on one thing for a long period of time >.<
Well, at least I decided to crack open those files today. I'm pleased to announce that I have successfully tree'd and I'm fleshing out the mechanics and working on the plot. I'd like to get some things finalized before I start making all the sprites.
Also, I should get around to posting those fanon god tiers I made on my DA. It'd be nice to have that all wrapped up.
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Post by TrickleJest on Sept 17, 2016 19:15:24 GMT
Mine was Eggstuck (aka complete shit)
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Post by Sharkalien on Sept 21, 2016 1:20:47 GMT
I forgot to make the living room assets for Househeld, so I made them yesterday (but I still need to finish them, fuck). Ha, if I had a year left to live, I'd spend most of it sleeping:   I still need to tweak that layer mask on the fireplace Maybe once I'm done with Househeld, I should release these rooms as PSD's, if they don't exist elsewhere already |
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Post by Blizzriel on Sept 21, 2016 2:55:54 GMT
The stairs in that second pic are doing some Escherian shit. Give that landing a back side.
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Post by Sharkalien on Sept 21, 2016 3:20:31 GMT
The stairs in that second pic are doing some Escherian shit. Give that landing a back side. Nice catch. It probably won't matter, though, since the corners will be cut off like in this panel:  |
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Post by Blizzriel on Sept 21, 2016 3:36:14 GMT
Ah, I see. It's still something to keep in mind if you plan on releasing the room as a whole.
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Post by Itsimplyace on Oct 2, 2016 13:45:32 GMT
What do you guys think of Pumpkin quest? I'm not really spending that much time on it because of school.
But I'd thought it would be a interesting little side project to do on my free time. Any feedback would be appreciated.
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Post by sparsilelammergeier on Oct 2, 2016 19:24:53 GMT
pumpkin quest seems really cool! the art is simple but it gets the idea across and the whole 'stuck somewhere' plot seems a bit reminiscent of early mspa, so maybe just try not to be too similar? the whole farmer thing is cool. overall, for a side project, its pretty interesting and i think ill be keeping tabs on it, aha!
anybody have thoughts on Paper Snow yet?
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Post by Sharkalien on Oct 3, 2016 1:47:50 GMT
What do you guys think of Pumpkin quest? I'm not really spending that much time on it because of school. But I'd thought it would be a interesting little side project to do on my free time. Any feedback would be appreciated. The "sick of your bullshit" face gets old real quick: That's how many times you've posted the same image in your adventure so far. I think you even reuploaded it each time, which is unnecessary. I'm not a real fan of updates that just note how stupid a suggestion is just for the sake of saying it's stupid. Why bother questioning its logic when you could turn it into something potentially funny anybody have thoughts on Paper Snow yet? I haven't read it yet, but a brief glimpse at the art style was enough to hook me in for later reading |
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tronn
Rungjumpin' Ragamuffin
Posts: 287
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Post by tronn on Oct 3, 2016 4:40:55 GMT
anybody have thoughts on Paper Snow yet? The art style is lovely, but you really need pay closer attention to the text (especially when English isn't your first language). Read through it at least twice to catch any glaring mistakes before putting it up. Good luck with your project, it looks promising! |
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Post by continuityofficer on Oct 3, 2016 6:39:25 GMT
What do you guys think of Pumpkin quest? I'm not really spending that much time on it because of school. But I'd thought it would be a interesting little side project to do on my free time. Any feedback would be appreciated. That's how many times you've posted the same image in your adventure so far. I think you even reuploaded it each time, which is unnecessary. I'm not a real fan of updates that just note how stupid a suggestion is just for the sake of saying it's stupid. Why bother questioning its logic when you could turn it into something potentially funny Im gonna quote something I think hussie may have once said. "Each panel either has to forward the plot, convey a character, or make a joke. Ideally 2 of these things. Panels that don't do at least one however, are pointless." Really, I dont think you have to not say the thing is stupid, but at the very least, you should try and do it in slightly different ways. Repetition is a principle of design, but so are contrast and proximity, so keeping in mind the exact context, and trying to make it original to the rest in some way is important. There's a point where narrative motifs become less cool, and more annoying. EDIT: Remember the rule of 3's aswell. If you are going to do the same thing, A joke will only ever work 3 times. The first time, you introduce it, the second you create a pattern, and the third you release the pattern (Ideally this one should be done at an ironic time, and all of them should still have contrast and proximity, but whatevs). The 4th time is when people get annoyed, and this only gets worse as you keep going on. |
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