thecrystalship
Mr. Snoozyprince Mcsleepypants
sushi guro
Posts: 174
Pronouns: she/her/hers
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Post by thecrystalship on Apr 14, 2016 6:45:53 GMT
The idea of Vriska being trapped in the game's machinations because she keeps wanting to play the game, while the others move on would be a very nice theme. Except it doesn't work like that. The Kids haven't successfully moved on: As far as we know they are still vulnerable to English, if not this iteration, then another. What the Kids have really done is just bailed to a temporary refuge while Vriska, despite her many flaws, is at least attempting to deal with the problem. If Vriska succeeded, then I've no doubt that her next move would be to head back to the B2 Session and join her friends in the new universe. What's even sillier is that the Flash itself seems to present a perfect opportunity for Caliborn. If they can use Dave's Time powers to skip ahead to a time when the Earth is more habitable, why can't Caliborn, a Lord of Time, simply time travel back to that period and murder everybody? Unless Time powers can't let you travel between a universe and a session, which would make sense, but then how did Gamzee get back to the B2 session? I'm confused. EDIT: Let's be real, there are a billion tiny questions like this, and we're just gonna have to wait for The End of Homestuck: Rebellion to answer all of them.
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Post by obsidalicious on Apr 14, 2016 6:54:25 GMT
The idea of Vriska being trapped in the game's machinations because she keeps wanting to play the game, while the others move on would be a very nice theme. Except it doesn't work like that. The Kids haven't successfully moved on: As far as we know they are still vulnerable to English, if not this iteration, then another. What the Kids have really done is just bailed to a temporary refuge while Vriska, despite her many flaws, is at least attempting to deal with the problem. If Vriska succeeded, then I've no doubt that her next move would be to head back to the B2 Session and join her friends in the new universe. What's even sillier is that the Flash itself seems to present a perfect opportunity for Caliborn. If they can use Dave's Time powers to skip ahead to a time when the Earth is more habitable, why can't Caliborn, a Lord of Time, simply time travel back to that period and murder everyone? Unless Time powers can't let you travel between a universe and a session, which would make sense, but then how did Gamzee get back to the B2 session? I'm confused. I don't think Lord English could just warp into the Universe, but he really doesn't need to. if Cascade taught us anything, it's that Universes are by no means Impenetrable Bastions of Safety. Besides, the essence of Lil Cal presumably still exists in the Void, and we know that Lord English pops up in many Universes across Paradox Space, so what's to stop a whole new iteration making an appearance? Also, a thought that occurs: Is Gl'bgolyb II still just hanging out on Earth? She has a long enough lifespan, so even after that Time Skip in which the water recedes and civilisation is re-established, she'd still just be there, hanging out, dominating the aquatic foodchain(and possibly several other biomes depending on how long her tentacles are). And it's not like they can get rid of her, any confrontation runs the risk of upsetting her and triggering another Glub. There's quite possibly a horde of )(IC's Mecha-Drones still hanging out too, probably still operating on the 'Kill all Humans" order they last received. Also, add Gl'bgolyb II's existence to the rapidly expanding list of questions we wanted answers too but aren't getting.
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Post by Gab on Apr 14, 2016 8:45:51 GMT
Okay I'm back and hoo boy is there a lot of ground to cover. To start with, here's the video I made on it, which introduces kind of the beginnings of my thoughts on it, as well as getting into some of what my initial reaction was like: www.youtube.com/watch?v=LK7My0KcZOcUsing a few hackneyed quotes to pull from the locked thread here, to start things off. The MSPAforums were getting toxic to the point that they've affecting my enjoyment of the comic and it's starting to leak here too it seems. I don't want to pop into the forums around April 13 or later just to see a bunch of posts that Homestuck wasn't worth it or something along those lines. I had this feeling about this place more than the forums. Not that Mspaf didn't feel trying at times, but here it feels like since there aren't as many people to ensure polite respectful discussion, and since there's just less people here in general, when an opinion you disagree with is voiced, it feels even harsher than normal. Once I saw Act 7, I was dreading coming back here. I didn't even know how *I* felt, so hussie only knows how the forum was going to take it. Honestly, I think being anxious about it for a solid 24 hours has helped me brace for it, in addition to working out my own feelings about it, because now it's honestly kind of funny. Man, we all we SO SURE Act 7 was going to be... well, not what it was. Whoopsies. ;P before the gigapause it was tricksters, before that it was act 6 in general, before that it was murderstuck, before that it was hivebent, before that it was the very concept of homestuck being not problem sleuth two. even in act 4 there were people complaining hs wasn't as good as it used to be in act 3. its a universal constant at this point. and I can't say i'm immune to it either. I scavenged these posts from the old thread a while ago, and when I saw this it was kind of a huge relief. To know that people were always moaning about something or other, helps me realize that how people were for the brief time I was on board the mspa forums was nothing new or some kind of bad omen for the direction of Homestuck (though more on this further down) and helps me not be so bothered by it. And despite how in the first 4 pages of this thread (where I'm at in catching up as of typing this) everyone is in a state of shock, reactions on the youtube page have actually been pretty positive, gives me hope the more critical opinions expressed here are the minority by far. Don't worry y'all, we're just in shock. We'll be okay. We'll be okay. WAIT NO! I have two more! -Act 7 will destroy the internet. -Homestuck will ascend to the God Tier Waste of Time. This in particular is one of the more hilarious predictions I've seen. Mind if I make it my headcanon? Woo, I made it all the way to THIS thread now. On we go! I feel like a lot of the big end of acts had focus returning to the 'real plot' which might not match up well with what happened in the act. For instance, for me, it felt like Cascade was all about the 4 kids and that the trolls were almost absent from it, when the trolls themselves dominated Act 5. Similarly, the ultimate point of Homestuck was a creation myth. We just kind of got distracted with the story that took place inbetween. Like Jane, Roxy, Dirk, etc... existing. Or the entire business with well, everything. It returns back to its basic form and sort of leaves out everything else. While I hadn't put together that EoAs were always specifically where this "refocusing" occurred, I had a very similar thought to this. Homestuck began when it was time for John and friends to start playing Sburb, and now it ends when the last objective of the game is completed and the kids are granted access into the universe they just created. Everything else, the time shenanigans, the trolls, even the villains, was ultimately an elaborate distraction, and time came to cut away from that. At least, that's one way to interpret things, a very straightforward one. With the greatness of CREATION, Homestuck ends. Questions remain. Many are probably already answered, but only as hints for puzzles to solve. That's fitting for Homestuck, a story that is also a puzzle. Just as this our own Universe, whose real questions, big and small, we often need to puzzle out. And sometimes, just contemplate. Or guess. Others questions are open for now. It will take a while to figure out which ones. Hiveswap might answer a few of them. For the rest, we may enjoy guessing. For now, seeing the *kids* enjoy themselves, and civilization restored, was a welcome reward. CREATION is a great power. One of the, I feel, much more thoughtful responses to the eoa7. Very well put. I hope maybe hussie talks more about it in the newsposts. I feel like he did a lot more pausing to catch up on homestuck than merited such a short ending. Also WTF is that white spirograph? Isn't that what was underneath the frog platform? I believe it's meant to be a symbol of creation. It appears throughout Homestuck. My long-term avatar is based on it. I've always seen it as a Lotus. I knew the mark had shown up in several places, but I never until right now saw it as a lotus, and now it's kind of starting to feel like an otim. So, good catch there. XD So, this ending really reminds me a lot of the ending of Mother 3, where you have this huge cataclysm of events that go down after you pull the final needle, but then the end is left ambiguous. Did everyone survive? Did the world get destroyed? Was it saved? They never give you a straight answer. And I think this ending is a lot like that. On one hand, that black hole was OBLITERATING Paradox Space along with all of the ghosts within it, but on the other, Can Town got built and all of our heroes got to live a new peaceful life again in paradise, but Caliborn was getting his immortality while the Ultimate Juju was used. There was this sense of everything coming together, yet nothing coming together at all. And I think that was the point. At the end of the day, we can't say for sure what the future holds, that idea of vanquishing evil, that good triumph over evil, or vice versa, it's a lot more gray than that. Another good post, but maybe I'm a little prejudiced since I like Mother 3 too. Yeeeeah... ;P I recall seeing this somewhere before the update came out, it's sure retroactively funny now, especially with how some people are now actually feeling betrayed by the comic and no longer wanting to share it with people, that's amazing. Guys Hussie just edited the newspost "Edit: one more thing. If you're curious about whether there will be anything resembling an epilogue to this ending, yes, I've been thinking about that for some time. It'll take a while to produce though, whatever specific form it ends up taking. Working on Collide took months, and came right down to the wire. I've got more time now though obviously. But that said, I'm not in a huge hurry at this point. Keep an eye out here for developments. There should be plenty of other news in coming months too." Hussie really should've just waited... until he was actually done... still, this is extremely relieving news Believe it or not this isn't how I interpreted it. First, I saw the talk of an epilogue as a big "MAYBE", though I think I was mistaken on that regard. Still, considering this is how he wanted to end the story, I doubt whatever epilogue he has in mind is going to be any more satisfactory to anyone here. I almost think that the very next update (whenever that happens) will have to be extremely meta. Like "MSPA Reader: Final freakout.", and it's just a montage of MSPA Reader reacting to all of the plot threads that were left unexplained. And at the very end, there's another record scratch and a shot of Hussie's hand stopping the record, or something equally stupid. And then it's just another one of Hussie's long tirades about how we're ungrateful and "Oh, now you want MORE? I thought you wanted this story to end as soon as possible?" I might actually forgive this fake ending if he did something so self-referential and hilarious, but I kind of doubt it, I've been let down twice in a row now. Except for the latter half of that thing, I could really see this being the epilogue. That, or like, some kind of movie-esque credits paged that I think was theorized about once. And damn, it just occurred to me but....none of these flashes have been called 'Rapture' so...did we not see that? Hussie's description of it doesn't seem to fit with anything we've seen. Sure the last two flashes were big and impressive but...they weren't crazy enough in my mind to warrant this: I bolded the part in the quote you provide that I think is important. The Rapture was never JUST something that happened in the story. I think it was going to be something that coincided with the anticipated end of the story. Maybe Hiveswap was supposed to be ready by then, or Undertale would come out. Anyway, as those hypothetical examples imply, I think whatever the Rapture was going to be fell apart when delays started happening all over the place. Homestuck IS "a story that is also a puzzle." In retrospect, it only makes sense we as a fandom would have to piece together our own ending. Gonna nix the spoilers real quick to say that if my post is tl;dr this quote is pretty much what I think the point of the ending was. Seeing this post about Act 7, I'm growing to like it even more as an actual ending. There's definitely stuff still left to be answered, but since we still have the prologue... yeah. I can say I like that theme. I still have to really dig into the post you linked, but it looks really intelligently written and approaches the ending from a much different angle than I have been doing, which is fantastic. Glad I won't be the only one shedding a more positive light on things in here. Perhaps... the ending presently eluding us is only the latest sleight of hand in the repertoire of an unseen riddler, one to engender a sense not of mirth, but of lack. His coarse schemes are those less of a prankster than a common pickpocket. Hahaha, yeah that quote from act one occurred to me too! Before the omegaunpause I wondered if that might see some resolution, tie into John's character maybe. If Andrew intended to have an ambiguous ending all along this could be seen as some of the longest term foreshadowing in the whole comic Though I don't know if he necessarily planned for that to happen... Yeahhhhhh it seems that the "making it up as you go along" approach can be a blessing and a curse. On the one hand, the ending aside, Hussie is GENERALLY very good at stuff like retroactive foreshadowing, stringing together disconnected plot points, etc etc. Cascade was a masterpiece! And I think it's the fact that we've seen what he's capable of that has resulted in so many people being disappointed... those high hopes existed for a reason. I still consider Homestuck a pretty good story overall, just in a "it's a journey that matters" way. It's MOSTLY a good story, which has some glaring faults but also a lot of cool, entertaining, thought-provoking, and and innovative stuff in it. Unfortunately, it could have been a really good whole if the ending had been solid, buuuut it wasn't really. It wasn't awful, just kinda... what everyone expected from a Sburb session, and was therefore NOT what people expected to see happen. We were expecting a symphony of converging plot points and clever twists, this just kinda fell flat while also leaving too many plot points unanswered. At least with Hiveswap, my hope is that it's going to benefit a lot from a) multiple writers contributing, b) the story being written beforehand, c) the opportunity for lots of editing. I can totally understand not wanting to get your hopes up though--Namco High was kind of unsatisfying as well, so that doesn't exactly inspire confidence. I'm still going to get it though. At the very least, this gives me a lot of confidence in my own story plans for the future, because I already know where most of them are going. If you want to have a strong story overall, the ending is CRUCIAL to figure out early on. Many of my favorite stories start out super strong, but have let me down when it comes to wrapping things up in a satisfying way. Sometimes a decent ending can be pulled together later in the story, but that's rare. I have to admit I'm a little surprised by your reaction here. Though I guess this was probably still written pretty close to when it dropped, and I've had a full day alone with my thoughts to craft a more "presentable" opinion. If it makes you feel any better, I think Andrew intends for Hiveswap to be a different kind of story than Homestuck altogether, even if they inhabit the same world. I.E. one that he does not think is best ended ambiguously. It's also something he's working on much more closely and presumably passionately than he did Namco High. Collide was a checklist. It was beautiful on its own right, but was also hardly climatic. Everything went according to the plan. In a way, you could say Cascade was the climax to Homestuck, the "great motherfucker" of the story after all. Act 6, half the full story in its own right, was one exceptionally long falling action leading into the conclusion, with a few ups and downs of its own along the way. Actually, viewed through this lens, Collide feels even less like an actual moment of tension or even plot resolution, and more like an action-packed, sort of goofy sendoff of sorts, a celebration to everything that made the comic so fun. Like a big farewell party, with the pages coming after being the moments afterward when everyone stops and takes a moment to appreciate things in a serious, sober, thoughtful manner, hence the major art bump and all that. And maybe, if I read it again, things will fall into place in a better way. Maybe after I read it again, I'll come back and say, "Oh, now I get it. That makes sense." For sure a beginning-to-end reread has got to be in the works for at least some of us now. For every page, every day that I stuck with the comic, I never anticipated the ending we got, it kind of changes my entire perception of the whole comic. I think it would be interesting. Finding the time to actually do that, on the other hand.... Oh, here's another Act 7 complaint I have that I haven't seen anyone make yet: Caliborn breaking the Clock: Why is that an Act 7 thing? It wasn't a climax or twist or reveal in any sense. We already knew that Caliborn was unconditionally immortal, and that he had Clockwork Magykks. We already knew that said power involved breaking the game in some way, as Aranea said that such a power was outside YoodlyBuggers jurisdiction. We know roughly when he got the power from Caliborn's masterpiece. Really the only thing all that brought to the table was the exact details of the power's origin. But such 'enlightenment' doesn't do much. It doesn't make any previously unanswered questions come together. It doesn't help us see older events in a new light that makes them make more sense. This scene could've been a part of Caliborn's masterpiece and freed up some time and space in Act 7 for more pressing matters to be resolved and answered. It brings the story of the time-warping villain around full-circle. Ironically, the villain is one of the only characters who gets a significant arc bridged in the end. And maybe I got more out of it because I remember saying before I took a break from the forums that I didn't like the idea of Caliborn just smashing his clock to get immortality. As I understood it, physically breaking it would mean there is no instrument to determine whether his death is heroic or just, so he revives anyway. But seeing it visualized in the animation, I start to see why I was mistaken. It plays into Caliborn's established pattern of breaking stuff, of course, and being rewarded for it. As well as his law of special exceptions. I think god tier clocks are meant to be an abstraction, something a player can never see or access, like their power up handy boy badges, thus Caliborn is a special case for having his de-abstratized and brought into reality for him to destroy. Further more, perhaps thanks to his very special Crowbar, he's able to harness the potent clockwork energies of the clock, and then thanks to his Cherub physiology, absorb them into his body. Also, since nobody pointed it out, I totally caught a sweet reference to A6A6I4, with Caliborn looking dead-on with one of my favorite panels in that one, where his face is flooded with "PURE ART TALENT." Or, I guess as it turns out the reality is, a pre-emptive retroactive call-fore-backwards? Wrapping my head around when Act 7 was actually made can be kind of brain warping some times. Suffice it to say, despite the simplicity of that scene, it was actually oddly satisfying for me. I don't know whether to feel more sorry for those deluding themselves that this is a temporary psyche, or for those who accept this is the end and feel completely betrayed by the lack of closure. Me? I liked the open ending. There's lots to play with here, both in terms of tracing a storyline and in grasping for Hussie's artistic / thematic aims - the latter are the most interesting to me. I recognize that many readers just wanted the Big Man to tell them a story - but wow, you sure chose a big dumb beautiful horse to bet on. Although Hussie knows the rules, he loves breaking them whenever he can in this phenomenally inventive work. Why were you so certain he'd meet your expectations? I'm nevertheless somewhat disappointed though, because I think there was the opportunity for an open ending that still had fun weaving a few more of the very many open plot threads together. I wanted to see Andrew Hussie play the game one more time. He's so good at the clever convolutions, and at dialog - so I wish we had those key elements of Homestuck represented in its closing. And I'm sad that almost no-one enjoys the idea we really can weave our own narrative here in this work that has been so much about reader involvement. The author made a news post containing a reader command that we "draw our own conclusions." I was sort of expecting a thousand fans to have done just that by now. I don't see it as being disappointing. If we look at Act 5 as the paragon example of how many disparate plot threads can be brought together succinctly to form a surprisingly cohesive storyline, then the pieces introduced throughout Act 6 by him are his final puzzle to us, the readers. We have been trained through study of his story in how it is done. Now, it is our turn. In this case, having our hand held by starting to tie them together at the last moment, even if leaving it "open" but easily solved with a little creative thinking and logical theory-crafting, would defeat the purpose a little bit. It's exactly open ended enough so that, should we decide to put the pieces together, only we can decide if it's really right or not, because the story will not give away that answer. And now that I bring it up, it really does feel like Homestuck is a story that is studied more than read. Its confusing fashion of revealing facts and events to us invites rereads or consultation of documentation that organizes all the information for us, such as the wiki. Despite the illusion it appears to present for so long, Homestuck is not a beginning-middle-end linear story with a few time loops thrown in to make it "complex." It really is kind of like a creation myth, where not everything about the "mythos" is learned in the right order, especially if you aren't reading the story directly, but consulting secondary sources, or discussing with friends. Except rather than being a body of information, themes, rules, and ideas being presented as a collection of many different stories, like the more typical idea of a mythos, it is presented in a single large story, that in some ways is still processed as if it were multiple smaller ones. Oh. I think I've just realised something. We can't possibly ever have seen the main plot of the alpha timeline come together. Because the chunk of paradox space that collapsed into the black hole and trapped LE and Vriska and the army of ghosts in with Alt!Calliope forever also had Andrew in it.
The author's been cut off forever from the story. There's nobody to generate any more canon. Gosh, that is fiendish. Hahahahahaha, that is remarkably fitting. If the author ended up double dying, then that's it, no more story. Green Sun black hole = pocket Lord English gets 8-ball eyes When Vriska unleashed the Treasure, before it turned into the House it looked suspiciously like a cue ball So it seems the intended interpretation is that the House would somehow blast Lord English into the new singularity he helped craft as part of his masterpiece of destruction. I wonder if that would do what I joked about long ago and cause his 'essence' to spread throughout the Furthest Ring, ever-present but harmless, always already everywhere? To be honest I didn't notice all this billiards-theming going on, and I dig it. I got to agree with Strawhat Luffy. Rules are there for a reason. It makes better storytelling. I honestly think Homestuck would have had a far better final if story rules were obeyed and all the rules in that image were followed. I mean, look what happened as a result of the comic disobeying story telling; it made the comic go in a bad direction and leaving many fans unsatisfied. This is why it's easier to just obey the rules of storytelling, because not doing so is very risky. Fair point. On the other hand, look at modern movies. Nothing but safe bets that adhere rigidly to standards set by prior successes, that might do alright at the box office, but that everyone hates because now every movie is the same. While Homestuck is getting a bit of flack now for going the unconventional route, at least it dared to be more creative, to not view the rules as holy, and for at least a time garnered the love and praise of a fairly significant crowd BECAUSE it defied norms. I'll always find it a bit of a bizarre argument to suggest that a story should have played it safe, which risks it being pointless and bland. Even a failure of a story (should you choose to look at it that way; in the case of HS, what even defines success or failure?) can have the clear signs of interesting ideas that could have been good if they'd been applied better, or maybe if luck had turned another way. Okay, that's that. Good grief, and I thought my saved up Daily Reactions Post was ridiculous. To be honest I thought I was gonna respond to some quotes and then write out my opinions raw, but I ended up getting into it here and there throughout this thing, and I think that will suffice for tonight. To those who are brave enough, may read this whole thing, or least various parts of it, and glean my general thoughts on Act 7. Bottom line: I think it's the ending Homestuck deserves, something that fits the story (and changes the story as we see it, for that matter), and will be remembered for a long time to come. To be honest, if it ended up being what we all thought it was going to be, and resolved all the plot points, and had a big epic fight and epilogue scene, that might have actually been the more disappointing, forgettable ending in the long run. We've already seen what that can look like, and no matter how much Andrew tries to raise the bar, it will ultimately become passe. This subversive ending (or double-subversive I guess) thus works as a sort of darkhorse ending I think, as the ultimate fitting conclusion to a story that danced the line between traditional plot writing and genre-busting metafiction. Oh, one more bottom line I thought of: Having personally come to the conclusion (for the time being) that the ending of Homestuck is being left in the hands of the readers, that it is our creativity and passion for the story which will be the cap to this great thing which has meant so much to many of us, I find it kind of funny to see how certain people who are applying a good deal of passion and creativity to insist the story should resolve itself instead. I was gonna add more to this, but it's getting really late and I'm getting really tired and this post is getting REALLY big and it's just too hard to focus. I should probably trim some of it down, but see again: too tired. I'll weigh in with more thoughts tomorrow. But here's one more very last ultra last minute thought: It's crystal clear Andrew KNEW this ending would make everyone double take, it's right there in the news post, where he mentions understanding what this ending means will take some reflection. Being on the kind of shocking side I'd bet was at least part of the point, of such an ending. And in the last few pages I have seen some people coming around, their opinion improving as they see other people's points of view, or just rewatch and think it over for themselves, which I think is nice. Maybe even one of the things that makes this ending the secret good ending it is. Anyway, that's all for tonight. Epilogue or no, this Homestuck thing has been a crazy ride, and now I don't know where my life is going to go without its dominating presence. Despite the two years worth of pauses I went through... maybe I'm being a touch dramatic, but still. To actually stop and acknowledge that this is it, the end of the line... To be honest, it feels good.
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Post by obsidalicious on Apr 14, 2016 9:46:22 GMT
Oh, here's another Act 7 complaint I have that I haven't seen anyone make yet: Caliborn breaking the Clock: Why is that an Act 7 thing? It wasn't a climax or twist or reveal in any sense. We already knew that Caliborn was unconditionally immortal, and that he had Clockwork Magykks. We already knew that said power involved breaking the game in some way, as Aranea said that such a power was outside YoodlyBuggers jurisdiction. We know roughly when he got the power from Caliborn's masterpiece. Really the only thing all that brought to the table was the exact details of the power's origin. But such 'enlightenment' doesn't do much. It doesn't make any previously unanswered questions come together. It doesn't help us see older events in a new light that makes them make more sense. This scene could've been a part of Caliborn's masterpiece and freed up some time and space in Act 7 for more pressing matters to be resolved and answered. It brings the story of the time-warping villain around full-circle. Ironically, the villain is one of the only characters who gets a significant arc bridged in the end. And maybe I got more out of it because I remember saying before I took a break from the forums that I didn't like the idea of Caliborn just smashing his clock to get immortality. As I understood it, physically breaking it would mean there is no instrument to determine whether his death is heroic or just, so he revives anyway. But seeing it visualized in the animation, I start to see why I was mistaken. It plays into Caliborn's established pattern of breaking stuff, of course, and being rewarded for it. As well as his law of special exceptions. I think god tier clocks are meant to be an abstraction, something a player can never see or access, like their power up handy boy badges, thus Caliborn is a special case for having his de-abstratized and brought into reality for him to destroy. Further more, perhaps thanks to his very special Crowbar, he's able to harness the potent clockwork energies of the clock, and then thanks to his Cherub physiology, absorb them into his body. Also, since nobody pointed it out, I totally caught a sweet reference to A6A6I4, with Caliborn looking dead-on with one of my favorite panels in that one, where his face is flooded with "PURE ART TALENT." Or, I guess as it turns out the reality is, a pre-emptive retroactive call-fore-backwards? Wrapping my head around when Act 7 was actually made can be kind of brain warping some times. Suffice it to say, despite the simplicity of that scene, it was actually oddly satisfying for me. I don't think the Clocks are as Abstract as you think. Doc Scratch just had Vriska's lying around in his apartment for whatever reasons. As for the stuff about showing the beginning and end of Caliborn: There's a whole bunch of events that could claim the Title of his Beginning: His Biological Birth, His Session Entry, His Denizen Defeat, This Clock, Getting sucked into the JuJu, Doc Scratch's conception, Emerging as English. Breaking the Clock was just one of many steps of ascension, it looks like it was only shown because it was the only one not yet shown. Or as one of the great poets of our time puts it: well shit thats a hell of a mystery no one thought was a mystery and didnt even really need solving but damn if it didnt just get solved so nice work Like I said, I'm not upset that it was shown at all, I just don't think it was crucial to Act 7, which is supposed to be the final climax and closing of major threads. I think it would have been better served as part of the masterpiece, and instead use Act 7 to show how the kids warp in for the masterpiece fight, which actually is a mystery that needs solving.
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